TAME frogs???

[froggsong]

I am starting this thread in response to a "discussion" I was having with Knightly on another thread. Everyone is welcome to chime in with their experience and opinion. If you express an opinion, please say that it is such, and explain why you feel that way. If you are relating experience, please give details so that we can perhaps come to a conclusion of the topic. Thanks in advance for the input.

To begin with, I am not trying to say that frogs will become tame like a dog or a cat (and a cat is hardly completely tame, but that is besides the point), but that they can become tame like a lizard can become tame (a lizard does not necessarily show affection, at least not in the way a dog or cat does. You also have to tame them with food as well as handling, and I believe the same can be done with some frogs).

Now I will explain myself on why I believe SOME frogs can become somewhat tame. My frogs do not eat every day. I feed them twice, sometimes three times a week. Not because I don't want to feed them or because I forget, but because they don't eat if I feed them more often. I do NOT feed my frogs with my hands, I never have. The only thing that comes in their cage with food in it is a tube or a tall shot glass that I have that I use to dust the feeders. If worms are going in for the FBT, they go in with tongs. My frogs do not associate my hands with food. My squirrel frogs (very similar to GTF's, even in appearance when green, and I have actually seen some sold in pet stores as GTF's because of misidentification, they also inhabit exactly the same habitat in the wild and can be found side by side) will walk right onto my hand, sometimes they will even jump onto my hand when I put it close to them in the cage. In order to get them off of my hand, I have to remove them. They seem to enjoy jumping all over me, but when I let them do that, they do not jump off of me into the room (I rarely actually take them out because of my cats and the danger of them getting too dry, or lost). I have also kept GTF's in the past, and they have been the same way. They do not get disturbed by your presence, because they are used to humans. These guys live in heavily populated areas. I'm sure if you caught some that were from an area that did not have alot of humans around, they might be a little more shy of us, but most WC GTF's and squirrel frogs are caught in heavily populated areas. This is how animals evolve, they adapt to their environment, and being skittish of humans would not benefit these frogs, so they have begun to be more comfortable around us.

That said, my banana frog (or golden frog - Polypedates leucomystax), Joe, is not tame at all, and will escape if he is given the chance and notices that he has it. He cannot be held, and it disturbs him if you try. I gave up trying to handle him LONG ago, because of the stress it causes him. It is my belief that these frogs come from areas of less dense population than can be found where the GTF's can be found.

My FBT is somewhat tame. He will walk up onto your hand if you put it in front of you, and will walk on your hands without trying to escape until you put him back. This does not seem to stress him in any way, he does not hide afterwards, and will sometimes immediately eat if I took him out before adding food (He is a voracious eater and gets fed more often than the frogs, but will sometimes eat all of the crickets I put in if left to do so, and I mean like 7 large crickets, there's no way he needs to eat that much. That's why his name is Starvin' Marvin).

My CWD also likes to come out and run all over my body, and he does associate my hands with food, since I feed him by hand most of the time. When he sees me coming to the cage, he either begs for food or begs to be let out. While the frogs don't beg to be let out, they certainly seem to enjoy it, they are always a healthy color while I am handling them, they do not hide when I put them back, and they will eat just fine after being put back into the habitat.

This is why I believe that SOME frogs can be tamed, just like SOME lizards can become tame (I would say a much greater number of lizards can become tame than the number of frogs that can). You cannot compare a frog to a cat, a dog, or a bird (which also do not become tame the same way a dog would), instead you must compare it to something it is somewhat closer related to, like a lizard. Consequently, I believe that my newt is also tame, she seems to enjoy being handled, and will come to the side of the cage begging to come out when I walk by. She is also an amphibian.

[froggsong]

No takers on this discussion? Come on, I know someone must have an opinion... or better yet, some experience to relate.

[bumper]

My FBTs and paddletail newts know that they get fed if I come to the tank and make some noise opening their vivarium. They hop to the same feeding area. The newts rub their faces on the glass. Very similar to feeding fish.

[Athen]

hey yall i opened this question up to a poll to make it a little more user friendly =)

[janelc]

Taming or training? That is the question... I don't know who is training who here. My red eared slider (I know, I know not a frog!) sees me and gets off his rock and paddles frantically for food. Did I train him to do that or did he train me to feed him when he swims so cute?!?!?! What do we mean by tame anyway? What is our definition?

[Athen]

Originally Posted by janelc

Taming or training? That is the question... I don't know who is training who here. My red eared slider (I know, I know not a frog!) sees me and gets off his rock and paddles frantically for food. Did I train him to do that or did he train me to feed him when he swims so cute?!?!?! What do we mean by tame anyway? What is our definition?

exactly janel that is the purpose of this thread to get that all sorted out. to you question of taming or training in the world of animals is there really much of a difference? cause if you look at it how can you really train anything with out it being somewhat tame? and for who is training who i believe it is a 2 way street we are training eachother you are teaching your turtle that when he does something specific he will get food and he is teaching you that when he wants food that is what he will do =) its a compromising world in order to get anything in this reality you always have to give something

[froggsong]

Originally Posted by Athen

exactly janel that is the purpose of this thread to get that all sorted out. to you question of taming or training in the world of animals is there really much of a difference? cause if you look at it how can you really train anything with out it being somewhat tame? and for who is training who i believe it is a 2 way street we are training eachother you are teaching your turtle that when he does something specific he will get food and he is teaching you that when he wants food that is what he will do =) its a compromising world in order to get anything in this reality you always have to give something

That is exactly my point, Athen.

Like I said, my frogs will come to my hand even though I do not use my hands to feed them. They will do so even when I have not put in any food. To me, I think that is being tame. My CWD is tame, and part of the way you do that quickly is to hand feed. It is all tied up WITH food, but not always just ABOUT food, if you get what I am saying.

[froggsong]

I think you should add a response to the poll, if it's possible. Something along the lines of : Yes, definitely, for SOME frogs.

I say this because though my squirrel frogs were tame, my Ploypedates leucomystax (golden tree frog) never has been.

[Athen]

ok thats a good idea i will go ahead and do that or at least see if i can figure it out.. lol

[froggsong]

Too bad I had already voted when that occurred to me... Now I can't vote for the response I wanted too...