How/where to get started ?

[trep]

Hi,

I'm kindda new to all this. I never had a vivarium and the only frogs ive ever had was these found in ponds etc.

So i wanted to get some frogs in a vivarium and here's the first question, what would be the best frogs species to start with ? I guess some are easier to keep than others.

Regarding the building of the vivarium, what kind of materials should i get ? what kind of plants ? what kind of silicons (i guess i must get one that is safe for the frogs and the plants) ? special lighting ?

I guess some questions may be vague or incomplete, but as i read answers and keep looking on the internet, i'll be able to post more accurate stuff hehe.

Here's a link i found, i think the idea is good of taking PVC and "Egg Crate". Tho, i have no clue where i could find "Egg Crate".

http://www.geocities.com/waltersvivarium/construct.html

So if any of you have any links i could use to get my informations feel free to post them !

Thanks !

trep

[Landon]

what type of viv are you interested in bulding, aquatic? terrestial? montane? tropical? you either need to determin what type of frog or what type of viv first. then you cna move onto what type of animal or what type of viv to build for the naimal you want. there are tons of great beginner frogs, but i need an idea of what you want befroe making blind reccomendations.

you want to stick wiht tropical plants when at all possible. the moreintense the lighting the more plants you can keep, but you get into temp control. i say the brightest most powerful lighting you can get is the best, as long as you arent cooking the inhabitants. of course this depends upon species as to what temps they can tolerate/prefer.

you can find egg crate in the lighting section of HD or Lowes.

heres a journal i made using the regular great stuff over false bottom method. feel free to ask any questions you hae about construction or materials.
29 gallon journal

heres another on a more current tank where i used some more unconventional methods of construction and drainage.
Viv from scratch

[trep]

Great, thanks for the reply !

Well, i would like to put up a tropical vivarium (if it can be done by a beginner of course heh). I don't know much about frogs and their species, but i saw some at the shop. They were blue/green and i think the guy kept talking about the green tree frog and the red eyed tree frog. I think these would be a good bet to start with. He also showed me a PacMan frog, which doesn't really interest me, it seemed to be fat and lazy hehe (i like when they can climb around).

I was wondering something about the lighting too, cause i owned an iguana before (10 years ago maybe) and i remember i had to install a light simulating the sun, cause the iguana required some "nutriments" from the light itself. Is it the same for frogs in general (maybe it depends of the spcecies).

Basically, i'll probably set up the vivarium in a 33 gal and i have a vague idea of the setup. I'll give it a try to put this on paper and upload the result here, to see if i'm going into the right direction.

trep

[Tindomul1of9]

Hey and welcome to the board.
One thing I like to say is that frogs and amphibians do not need heaters or lights that simulate the sun. When you get lights for your tanks, you are getting them for two reasons.
1) to get plants to grow and keep them happy
2) to get the inhabitants (frogs or otherwise) used to a day/night cycle

I reccommend green tree frogs before going for a red eyed. I'm not sure whether red-eyes are really harder to keep, but they are or at least were more expensive, so if you make a mistake or it gets sick or something, you lost a cheaper animal if you go with the green tree frogs.
I agree, Packmans are not good begginners becuase they don't do anything and are boring. Green tree frogs are nocturnal, and will become active a few hours before you go to bed till a few hours after you wake up.

Tropical vivariums are easy. But if you like the false bottom method, I will let Landon help you out.
Good luck!

[Landon]

tropical viv can definatly be done as a beginner. the frogs you mentioned are good candidates for a beginner also. if these are your first frogs i would take Tindo's advice and go with the green tree frog to start. they arent that active during the day, but can be trained to come out more for food. the red eyes arent that much harder to keep, but uless you get CB they are more than likely recently imported, and much more succeptable to disease and stress. the pacmans are more for kids, IMO, as they are just fun to watch eat. other than that just just sit half (or whole) burried in the substrate waiting for more food.

as far as lighting goes, i like to use as much as possible without letting the tank get too hot. most amhibs do not require UV, but need humidity and correct temps. it is undecided if amphibians thermoregulate on the same levels as some reptiles. im sure some can, but they are generally much more sensative to temp range and stability. you just dont want fried frogs

[trep]

Hi, thanks for the replies !

I went to the shop this morning to see what kind of equipments they had and prices hehe. The green tree frogs looked cool and they weren't very expensive, i think that's gonna be good frogs to start with !

I was also looking at the water pumps and filtration system. I must say i'm totally clueless about how i'm gonna do a little waterfall. So, if any of you have pictures of how they build their waterfall, filtration, etc. that would be great ! Any advices could be useful too (ie: kind of piping to use, pump, filtration system, removing harmful bacterias from the equipments i buy etc.)

While gathering informations about others tank setup, i noticed some people used "tubing foam" to stick their branches and plants on the back of the tank. My first idea was to get a foam board and fix it using silicones. Since it's my first try, i want something i can clean up so i can re-build a new one if something goes bad. So, is the "tubing foam" easy to remove ? And what about the silicone on the glass ? Could it work out with only a foam board (http://www.barrule.com/Workshop/imag.../foamboard.jpg) ?

Also, regarding the temperature and humidity of the tank. Is it important to have a water heater ? I was planning on having only a screen on the top of the tank, and the light sitting on the screen. Would it let too much humidity going out of the tank ? Or would you recommend to totally cover the top of the tank ?

That's about the questions i had today hehe

Thanks again, and sorry for the english, i'm french native, so i'm missing some "terms"

trep

[Landon]

glad you like the green tree frogs. i wonder if they are the native species from here. i guess you guys have green tree frogs in france also

as far as water pumps, you just want to make sure you have something dependable. i like the maxijets and marineland pumps. some people usr regular PVC but i prefer the soft clear pvc tubing as opposed to the pipe. its a lot easier to work with and you dont have to be as exact wiht measurements for cutting and what not. there is also a lot less chance for noise from vibration.

on the foam board, make sure it is safe and will not break down over time. im not familiar wiht the stuff in the link you posted. ive used some construction grade insulation foam that is made by the dupont (i think, it has their logo on it) company. i got them to send me a spec sheet and its made with food safe materials and wont break down over time.

for attaching wood, i like to attach the wood straight to the glass, then do whatever foaming buling around it. i havent had good luck with expanding foam holding wood, and i havent done enough testing with the construction foam to find out how well silicone bonds to it.

another foam to look into is "Great Stuff". its an expanding foam that comes in an aresol can. its commonly used to build waterfalls, backgrounds, and much more in vivs. if you cant find actual "great stuff" any polyurethane based expanding foam should do the trick.

[trep]

Alright, thanks for the input !

And i'm french from north america hehe, i'll let you guess from where in NA

trep

[Tindomul1of9]

I use the polyurethane expanding foam and It hold drift wood nicely.
I'd go with Landon on the pump advice.
I would try to stick to room temperature and 60-70% humidity for greenies. My avatar is an American Green Tree Frog. They also don't need a water heater. Well that depends on how cold it gets where you are gonna keep it. They will be fine with temps in the low 60's to temps in the 80's, and they will do really well with temps from 65-80.

[trep]

I guess i'll go with the expanding foam them, but could someone tell me if it's easy to clean up once it dried ?

Also, should i use a filter for the water, or just a pump to create a circulation ? Some people seem to say that the stones etc. in the waterfall will kindda act as a filter. Would i need a particular type of stone for this, or it's just the normal bacteria whos gonna clean up the water ?

Thanks for the inputs !

trep