False Bottoms/Water Features

Pittylova · #1 (**permalink**) 09-09-2008, 03:29 PM

I have been looking through the pictures and threads involving water features and false bottoms. I'm a little confused.

I understand the concept of the false bottom, and pretty much how the waterfall works, etc. However my question is in regards to the pool at the end of most water features that the stream leads into. How exactly do you get the water from the pool to circulate into the false bottom so it can go back up into the waterfall? I plan on having a rather large pool (I'll call it a pond lol), and have a rubber maid type of container for it. I plan on having fish in the pond so this is why I want such a large feature (it's a 12 gallon container). I was planning on putting silicone around it to attack gravel/rocks to make it look more natural. Do I just drill small holes into the bottom/sides for drainage?

Also, is there any way to do a pool that has the open front for viewing that will be secure enough to the front glass so the fish will be ok and not make their way into the FB? Ultimately I'd like to cut off one of the sides of the bin to make it viewable through the glass.

Thanks in advance!

postal · #2 (**permalink**) 09-09-2008, 04:18 PM

Generally with a false bottom, the pool *IS* the bottom.

The stream runs down to the water underneath at the bottom of the tank, and the pool is just a part of that. If the water level is too deep, gravel/stones in the pool to make it more shallow. You can place the pump anywhere in the false bottom that is easy to access, and the hose carries water to the top of the falls, runs down the fall- down the stream- to the pond which is just an area lower than the substrate so you can see the water of the false bottom.. The weedblock/screen/mesh/sand/gravel/aquarium gravel/whatever--- will let water pass through from the pond to the rest of the false bottom.

It sounds to me like you're confusing the difference and benefits of a false bottom with a recirculating stand alone waterfall / pond.

There are other ways of doing it with a "closed system" like the prefab plastic waterfalls you can buy from zoo med which has a fall and pond but the water never leaves the system into the vive itself.

Lastly- If you want a pool big enough for fish and keep fish in the pond without getting under the "land" section... Most people silicone a piece of glass accross the bottom of the tank to make a water tight pool for the fish, and land on the other side of the glass partition- This sounds more like what you should be looking into. The downside of this method (not that I'm an expert on it- just read alot!) Is the water to land transition is usually rather abrupt... Imagine the glass is 3 inches high separating the tank into 2 parts... one side water, one side land.... there is a 3 inch drop from land to the bottom of the water- You can slope it with rock or gravel, or better yet, angle the glass you use for the partition...

Others can give you better specifics on this subject- I just do false bottoms with a pond- not the others I mentioned which may be more suitable for you.

Dragas · #3 (**permalink**) 09-09-2008, 05:08 PM

Being a newbie and in the initial design stages of my tank, this site has been helpfull.

victri.net

I am not a big fan of leaving the eggcrate exposed though ...

But it is detailed.

Pittylova · #4 (**permalink**) 09-09-2008, 05:32 PM

I think that my confusion lies in the images of the pools having rocks, etc in them yet being a false bottom. I have seen people use containers and put GS over them and cut the egg crate to fit around the GSed container. Is the GS not leak proof? I haven't used GS or any of this yet so I'm not sure. I'm going to try to find a picture of what I'm referring to.

postal · #5 (**permalink**) 09-10-2008, 06:03 PM

I think generally, when you see a container for the pool, it's a closed loop water system and not a false bottom. This means the pump or intake hose has to be in the container.

Unless the container has holes drilled in it everywhere, and the container is just to hold the rocks in place for the pond.... and the water leaks out of the container into the false bottom- which can be done.

I'm not sure about gs working to seal off water features- I dunno.

Pittylova · #6 (**permalink**) 09-10-2008, 09:59 PM

Of course now that I'm looking for pictures of what I'm talking about I can't find any. I saw a bunch of them before. So I'm thinking I'll probably just do a false bottom. Now for the pool I was going to slant in some eggcrate and cover it with mesh. This way there is a slope to get in and out of the pool, and the fish and frogs/lizards won't be able to get stuck under the egg crate. Now I still want something natural looking so can gravel or river rocks be stuck onto the mesh some how? Would silicone work as long as the entire thing isn't covered with the silicone so water can circulate?

Tiamat · #7 (**permalink**) 09-10-2008, 11:12 PM

Well, i would say yes if i understand you correctly. That is pretty much the general concept of a pond merged with a FB.

Personaly, i use flat rock that i glue with silicon only partially, making it possible for water to pass under at least half the rock. The rest is just 'cover up' operations.

Or even simplier: you just put a bed of rocks in your pond if the slope is not high, and shape the rocky bed to cover the mesh. Of course, this way works best with shallow ponds.

I am not an expert on flow dynamic. But i believe that you really need only a hole in your pond as big as the one coming out of your pump. So you have a bit of lose.

postal · #8 (**permalink**) 09-11-2008, 01:40 AM

I think generally, if you silicone something on the screen... (the larger the object the better) The silicone will hold the material on the screen to hide it, but you will still get plenty of waterflow through it.

Gravel or rock would work well. Fine sand may clog the screen.

Sounds like you got the right idea though regarding that particular subject.

It seems to me however, that you should llok more into the separate water/land feature with the glass partition since you want to keep fish.

I'm not saying that it's your *best* option... but something you should be familiar with before you make any decisions...

Green Ghost · #9 (**permalink**) 09-11-2008, 03:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pittylova

...Also, is there any way to do a pool that has the open front for viewing that will be secure enough to the front glass so the fish will be ok and not make their way into the FB? Ultimately I'd like to cut off one of the sides of the bin to make it viewable through the glass...

My 2 cents: think of a FB as a ledge for a land portion... except that its the same footprint as the tank floor.

If you reduced the surface area of the FB and made it - lets say half of the tank (lengthwise) - and you stuck the (now halved) FB at the rear of the tank, then you could have a land portion at the back and fill the bottom of the tank with water up to the ledge. This way your fish would have the maximum amount of water because they could swim under the (halved) FB.

Then the front edge of the FB (probably eggcrate) would be exposed and this might not be a "natural" look. You just edge the eggcrate with a piece of branch or branches.

If you want a waterfall, place the pump or filter somewhere in the water section under the FB where you can have access to it later and have the output end so that it comes out of the top of the waterfeature. Pumps cam be placed vertically or water can be directed via tubing.

Pittylova · #10 (**permalink**) 09-11-2008, 08:01 AM

Thank you very much everybody. I think I have it now...I'm glad you had patience with my dumbness on the subject lol! I'm thinking about doing like Green Ghost said. I'm going to make the GS background on the back and side where the pool is slope into the water at an angle to add some leverage for the critters to get out of the pool if needed. Again, I appreciate everything.