hi guys

[mdrs]

Hey everyone, just wanted to make an intro. i'm a total newb to dart frogs but i'm not one of those people that doesn't like to research. one of my fav things to do before and while i keep an animal. i've been keeping freshwater fish for about 10 years and ball pythons for about six. i can post pics if anyone's interested as i'm crazy about planted freshwater aquariums in particular.

as far as dart frogs go, i'd like to start out with an arboreal species, if possible as the enclosure will need to be space efficient. i'd like to have a large vivarium as i'm planning on making one, but i have a lot of tanks in my apt already and space is getting tight (hence the vertical vivarium idea). i'll try and outline my main questions here.

plants - what kind of plants can one grow in these vivariums? are there any kinds of vines that prove manageable? i've heard of java moss being grown immersed but growing too tall, without larger frogs to keep it trampled down. are there any other suitable mosses? i'd like to have no fake plants in my vivarium as i take pride in maintaing an entire habitat whenever possible.

water - i've seen many types of water in a tank and while i plan on simulating a waterfall i wanted to know if still water is suitable?

lighting - i've heard CF is the way to go here but i imagine it's a personal taste issue. to maintain plants, i'd like to stick to close to 6700K, however. i'm sure heat is a main issue as well since PDFs don't seem to like anything higher than 90F is this true?

humidity - i know this has to be high but how high? i'm guessing no lower than 85-90%? i also need to know more about proper mister setups as i've never been required to use them before.

this is all i can think of right now so feel free to add stuff i forgot. thanks all.

[Tindomul1of9]

Hey,

Welcome to Vivarium Forums
Okay, you can grow all sorts of tropical plants in PDF(Poison Dart Frog) enclosures. Some common vines include species of Pilea, Philodendron, Dischidea, etc... There are many.
Moss, I myself grow what might be Java Moss, and tropical moss. Both do well under PDF conditions. The trick with moss is lighting.
Humidity, PDF's like 80-100% humidity! Anything less will put your froggy in danger.
Temps, most PDF's like it between 65 and 80. D. pumilio, among a few others I believe, like it between 65-85ish.
Now, I believe that the best begginner arboreal PDF is D. pumilio. The drawback to that is that they are expensive. Then again, they are probably the least expensive of the arboreal species, and the largest of them.
Arboreal species include, D. pumilio, D. intermedius, D. fantasticus, D. imitator, D. reticulatus, and D. variabilis.
Keeping these species you need to grow bromiliads in your vivarium, which these PDF's use as homes and breeding sites.
Now for the most important aspect of keeping PDF's. You must learn how to culture your own food for them. They eat small fruit flies, and springtails. This is the staple diet of all PDF's. They will not eat crickets unless you get true pinheads, and or you have a really big terrestrial PDF like Phyllobates terribilis, or D. galactonotus.
So, your best bet is to build the viv, plant it. Seed it with springtails and other microfauna, learn how to keep and maintain a steady stream of fruit fly cultures, and then choose the best PDF you like.
Really, once you are comfortable that you can provide the correct food, and temps, and home for whatever species you want, you can get any PDF.

[Tindomul1of9]

Ohh, can you show us pics of you planted tanks? Thanks!

[mdrs]

hey man, thanks for the replies. that pretty much confirms what i've read today and thanks for the help with the species names for the arborials. i'm stoked to start looking into plants and thinking about scape for the viv.

here are some pics of my planted tank and girl's ball python. they're both progressing slowly but we like em.

https://www.vivariumforum.com/communi...er=242&cat=500

[Rainfrog]

Great Pics! How large is your Royal? Mine is about 23". maybi one day ill get some pics up!

[mdrs]

he's about 28-30''. let me know when you get some pics up.

[Tindomul1of9]

How do you keep him from destroying all your plants. THat tank looks great!
Oh and your welcome.

[Landon]

very nice planted tank. what are the dimensions of it? it looks huge!!

i think Tindomul has your Qs answered the same way i would. i would only add D. ventrimaculatus to the good beginner thumbnails. they are a little more reclcusive than some of the other species, but are proven hardy and fairly easy to breed. they use vertical and horzintal space.

for a little larger frog the D. leucomelas could fit your bill. they are an attractive bold species that are often reccomended as one of the best beginner PDFs of any size. they are readily available, fairly cheap (in PDF terms ), hardy eaters, relatively easy to breed, and they like to use vertical space as well.

also, depending on how your tank is desigend, you could make a very tall tank accesible for all frogs. in our small tanks (compared to nature) i doubt we create anything taller than the most terrestial frogs venture up into in the wild. of course you wouldnt want to put a really big terrestial frog in there and expect them to be able to climb to the top on small elafed vines, but a terraced layout with legdes, and thick leafed strong plants, could get even tincs to the top happily. depth front to back helps tremendously in achieving this. thing abot that if you end up building your own tank. every inch you can get front to back will be a big help in decorating the tank.

definatly take the advice to start culturing food items ahead of time. its one of the most challenging aspects of keeping these little gems.

good luck!!

[mdrs]

Originally Posted by Tindomul1of9

How do you keep him from destroying all your plants. THat tank looks great!
Oh and your welcome.

well it took me months but i trained him to leave the plants alone. i had to start tying them down till he was convinced he couldn't uproot them anymore. took like six months. then i just started adding them really slowly. he calmed down. he used to kill everything alive, including plants and other oscars.

the tank is just a 75. i have some tiger barbs, a jack dempsey, two ottos, and three africans in there. it's overcrowded but i clean that thing like twice a day because i'm really picky about the black sand being clean. everyone seems to get along now. had to get rid of a problem convict but all in all, it's pretty harmonious.

[Tindomul1of9]

Cool story. I never thought of training a fish to leave plants alone. Glad to hear it can be done. I would not be able to do it.