Water Preference for Green Tree Frog and Firebelly Toad

KBeard · #1 (**permalink**) 01-22-2009, 11:22 PM

Hi all,

I've done a google search and haven't been able to find an answer. Does anyone know if GTF's and FBT's can handle PH 7.8 water?

The habitat their currently in reads 7.2 PH but has really high nitrates. The new habitat that I've set up is within the "safe" limits (of nitrates) according to my tests, so the nitrates I'm not really worried about. I am however, concerned about the PH.

Thanks in advance..

po78 · #2 (**permalink**) 03-16-2009, 09:57 PM

This is probably the least technical/scientific answer you'll get. I have fire bellies and two treefrogs, but they are not like fish. I've had them for two years, and I've never tested or even been concerned about the ph or Nitrates. They are very healthy. Just keep it clean. Maybe it's because I have a 20 gallon Tetra Repti Filter for only 4 gallons of water. Frogs are very adaptable, and if you keep the water clean, they will be CHILLIN'!

froggsong · #3 (**permalink**) 03-17-2009, 12:29 AM

I'd say that that pH is too high. Frogs are very sensitive to any conditions, especially water, because their skin is so permeable (so they can basically "drink" through their skin). Now, I haven't tested my water in the frog tank for quite some time, but last time I did, my water was 7.0. I don't know if the nitrates are such a big deal, but I'm sure the pH is. Try to get it to neutral, then put some aquatic plants in the water to get rid of the nitrates. If you don't have deep enough water for submerged plants, try some floating ones. Duckweed is great to suck up nitrates. The fire bellies will like it too (they like to hide under it and pop up their heads enough to look around).

Chu'Wuti · #4 (**permalink**) 03-17-2009, 02:09 AM

The nitrates are a big deal, too. As Froggsong explained, frogs are very sensitive. Some zoologists/herpetologists call frogs the canaries of the terrestrial environment, because they react faster than any other animal to environmental changes, such as pollution. Nitrates and nitrites are a form of pollution that builds up in water over time when aquatic or semi-aquatic species are living in the water.

Phil, you may be in an area that has water of a good quality; that would explain why your frogs are doing really well even though you haven't been checking pH, nitrates, nitrites, etc. in their water. Even so, unless you are changing their water frequently, nitrates & nitrites could be building up to unhealthy levels in your water.

However, some people on this forum live in places where the water is pretty bad. Also, most municipal water supplies are treated with chlorine, fluorine, and other chemicals to make it safer for humans to drink. But we're not living in it the way frogs do. So the vast majority of us will need to check the water and adjust it to make it safer for our animals.

Now, KBeard, 7.8 is not horribly high, so your frogs would probably survive it, but they'll be healthier if you bring it to neutral or closer to neutral--unless they are a species that evolved in higher or lower pH conditions. When you cannot find out what they need, assume neutral is best.

I don't know of frogs that require other pH levels, but there are some fish that require much different pH from the average tropicals. Killifish are an example--they need very acidic conditions, as explained here:

Quote:

The water values depend entirely on what biotope that the species inhabits. MostAphyosemion species can be kept in water with a pH from 5.5-7.0, a water hardness from 3-10 dH, and a varying water temperature. Aplocheilus species prefer water with a pH from 6.0-7.5 and a water hardness from 3-10

from Killifish.

Your GTFs & FBTs should be fine in neutral water. However, you should not keep the two species in the same enclosure--the FBTs have skin toxins that could be injurious to your GTFs. In particular, when the FBTs go into the water, the toxins leach out of their skin into the water, and over a period of a few days, the amount of toxins in the water can build up to lethal concentrations for the GTFs.

po78 · #5 (**permalink**) 03-17-2009, 12:24 PM

No, I understand what you r saying, and I know they are super sensitive since they also "breath" through their skin. I just have a super strong filter with all three types of filtration, and it is runs 4 times stronger than the amount of water I have. I do partial water changes every couple of months, but i just syphon it to get the debris out. I also use a dechlorinator for changes and top offs.

RecycledAgain · #6 (**permalink**) 03-24-2009, 11:21 PM

My question would be how old is the tank ... Nitrates will spike in a new tank regardless of what you do. Ph is correctable with drops if your tap water is off, or just use spring water if that makes you feel better.

Air Humidity is the factor for most frogs and 7.8 Ph has little or no factor when its absorbed in air moisture, as for the toads I have yet to see anything kill them.

If you are getting 7.2 ph why the question about 7.8 Kbeard? 7.0 is neutral.

Dan

bzishka · #7 (**permalink**) 04-08-2009, 05:28 PM

its tru 7 is neutral, and take it from the fish guy (me) i have a gar tank, and above this i have a green tree frog tank, my tank water goes in, cleaner tank water goes out.

you should worry about what your ammonia lvls are more then your ph, even if you have nitrates, your lvls have to be really high before you can do harm to a green tree frog, and fire bellied toads, i don't think i have ever seen a dead one? have you?

beckdg · #8 (**permalink**) 04-09-2009, 07:07 AM

alot of us own or breed fish... even for feeders... if you have ammonia change the water more often.... for your ph... soften the water with plants or peat filtration... NEVER WATER SOFTENERS... or use r/o water mixed in to make it neutral.... chloramine will be your culprit if your township/city provides your water... treat it to remove toxicity as chloramine cannot easily be removed and wont gas out like chlorine.... the canary thing is very true and more widespread usage wise... frogs and amphibs are dying off at an alarming rate because of our climate and waste... more than any other type of life... they ARE the most sensitive creatures when it comes to environment.... for nitrates any floating plant will do wonders... some are better than others... dispose of them properly though when you are done with them as some have become a nuissance in our native waters

btw... i keep a community and a breeder fish tank... chu has at least a community and froggy has at least a breeder... we are all well versed as many people on this forum are... many of us keep them planted and even have reef tanks fully stocked... check my signature if you'd like

bzishka · #9 (**permalink**) 04-14-2009, 02:30 PM

so are you one of those people that gets mad and needs to let it all out on a frog forum, anyway i told what he needed to do for his green tree frog, was anything else on debate here?

btw the signature ain't long enough for all my critters and fish.

RecycledAgain · #10 (**permalink**) 04-14-2009, 04:04 PM

bzshka... Whats that all about? I'm more than a little confused about that last post.. If you disagree with beck please tell us why. I wouldn't mind seeing other opinions, especially if someone else's experiences are relevant to the post, I'm interested; If it was no more than slam ,, keep it to yourself next time.

Would you be so kind as to elaborate?

Dan